WP 95 | Facing Fear and Embracing Risk in Your Practice with Neal Samudre

Written By James Marland

Facing Fear and Embracing Risk in Your Faith-Based Practice

As faith-based therapists, we're often called to a unique balance—combining professional expertise with spiritual guidance to offer holistic care to our clients. However, running a practice isn't just about offering care; it also involves navigating the complexities of business growth, especially in an industry that's rapidly evolving.

In a recent episode of the Wise Practice Podcast, Whitney Owens sat down with Neal Samudre, founder of Entrecare and co-founder of Enjoyco, a group practice in Nashville, Tennessee. Their conversation centered on a topic that's incredibly relevant to many of us: facing fear and embracing risk in our practices.

Understanding the Climate of Change

Neal highlighted the significant shifts happening in the mental health industry—telehealth, counseling compacts, and the rise of mental health tech companies. These changes require adaptation, but many practice owners are hesitant to take the necessary leaps due to fear, anxiety, and imposter syndrome.

Neal shared a powerful insight: “The emotion of fear is a good thing...but the spirit of fear is a bad thing. God did not give us the spirit of fear.” This distinction is crucial for faith-based practice owners. Fear, when used wisely, can guide us to make prudent decisions. However, when it becomes a dominating spirit, it holds us back from the potential that God has set before us.

The Role of Faith in Risk-Taking

As faith-based practitioners, we understand that living in faith sometimes feels contrary to taking risks. Yet, Neal emphasized that “when we live in that spirit of fear, we're not stepping forward.” Our mission is not just to avoid mistakes but to boldly step into the calling God has placed on our lives and practices.

Whitney echoed this sentiment, reminding us that “when we live in that spirit of fear, we're missing out on impacting the kingdom.” Whether it’s starting a practice, expanding services, or taking on new roles, these steps are necessary to fulfill the larger purpose God has for our work.

Embracing the Spirit of Play

Neal introduced an inspiring concept that may resonate deeply with many of us: the importance of feeling safe to play. He explained, “When you do things out of play and joy, you tap into this inner genius, this creativity that comes from God.” Too often, practice owners are caught in a cycle of playing it safe rather than feeling safe to play. This shift in mindset can unlock creativity and growth, allowing our practices to thrive.

Whitney shared a personal experience from a recent mastermind retreat, where the sense of safety within a community allowed her to relax, play, and return to her practice with renewed confidence and clarity. This underscores the importance of community and support in overcoming the barriers we face.

Overcoming Challenges

One of the biggest hurdles in embracing risk is the emotional toll of our work. As Neal pointed out, “Therapists spend their entire days talking with clients that have intense trauma...at the end of the day, there's just nothing left to grow their business.” This exhaustion can lead to numbness and a reluctance to step into the discomfort of business growth.

However, Neal offered a powerful course of action: community. “Having a supportive community that gets it, but also calls you out of yourself, is key to overcoming these challenges.” This community can come in the form of fellow practitioners, mentors, or a coach who can help you navigate the complexities of growth while staying true to your faith and calling.

Course of Action: Moving from Fear to Faith

As you reflect on your own practice, consider these steps to move from fear to faith:

  1. Acknowledge the Spirit of Fear: Identify areas where fear is holding you back and differentiate between healthy caution and a paralyzing spirit of fear.

  2. Embrace the Spirit of Play: Allow yourself to feel safe to explore, create, and innovate within your practice. Remember that God has given you a spirit of joy, not fear.

  3. Seek Community: Surround yourself with a supportive community that can offer both encouragement and accountability. This might be a professional network, a mastermind group, or a coach who understands your unique challenges.

  4. Reflect and Journal: Take time to reflect on your patterns, decision-making processes, and the ways you may be getting in your own way. Be honest with yourself, but avoid self-criticism that leads to paralysis.

  5. Take the First Step: Whether it’s expanding your practice, hiring a new therapist, or launching a new service, take that first step. As Neal reminded us, “The greatest risk is not taking any risks at all.”

By embracing these steps, you can move from a place of fear to a place of faith, allowing your practice to grow in alignment with the purpose God has for you. As Neal so beautifully put it, “Imagine how much good can come from that.”

Show Sponsor Twin Oaks Medical Management

  • With Twin Oaks Medical Management as your partner, you will have the confidence and peace of mind that your business is taken care of. No longer having to worry about the time-consuming day to day business operations, you’ll be able to focus your time and energy back on treating your patients, all while maximizing your profits!

Show Sponsor Arc Integrated

  • Arc Integrated specializes in helping leaders navigate change with confidence. With personalized coaching, leadership training and strategic planning, Arc Integrated helps clients to reduce stress, enhance communication, and build emotional intelligence within their teams. Visit www.arcintegrated.com/coaching to schedule a free leadership consultation.  You'll have the chance to receive some tangible strategies to help drive the success of your practice. 

Neal Samudre Resources

Links and Resources



Podcast Production and Show Notes by Course Creation Studio.

  • acing Fear and Embracing Risk in Your Practice with Neal Samudre | WP95

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    ​[00:00:49] Whitney Owens: Hi, I'm Whitney Owens. I'm a group practice owner and faith based practice consultant. And I'm here to tell you that you can have it all. Want to grow your practice? Want to grow your faith? Want to enjoy your life outside of work?

    [00:01:03] Whitney Owens: You've come to the right place. Each week on the Wise Practice Podcast, I will give you the action steps to have a successful faith based practice while also having a good time. Now let's get started.

    [00:05:25] Whitney Owens: Hello friends and welcome back to the wise practice podcast. I'm so glad you're here because you were in for a treat as I'm interviewing Neil Samudray and he is the founder of Entrecare. It's a consulting company helping practice owners scale their practice. He is also the co founder of the group practice in Nashville, Tennessee called Enjoyco.

    [00:05:44] Whitney Owens: He is the author of Start From Joy and as a former marketing executive and joy nerd, he helps practice their practice. Profit practice therapists. There we go. Expand their mindset, grow their practice into a self running systematized practice. Thank you, Neil, for coming on the show.

    [00:06:02] Neal Samudre: Thanks for having me Whitney.

    [00:06:04] Neal Samudre: So excited.

    [00:06:05] Whitney Owens: Yeah, me too. Me too. Well, I'm looking forward to our conversation today because I always really love when I get on with people and we're like, what are we going to talk about? And we just kind of listen to the spirit. What's within us? What's in our gut? What we're hearing and we talk about it.

    [00:06:19] Whitney Owens: And I think your topic that you brought today when we got on was so great. Like, I was mesmerized. So we're going to talk about risk taking.

    [00:06:27] Neal Samudre: Yes,

    [00:06:28] Whitney Owens: and private practice. But before we get into that, I kind of shared a little bit about your professional life. You share a little bit about your personal life. He married, got kids.

    [00:06:36] Whitney Owens: What do you like to do for fun? And then let's jump into talking about private practice.

    [00:06:40] Neal Samudre: Awesome. Well, you know, I live outside of Nashville, Tennessee, and a place called Spring Hill. It's just a little bit south of Nashville, but we got our group practice here that I run with my wife. So all the husband, wife, entrepreneur duos listening to this podcast, I totally feel you, um, we work really well together, uh, but we have a three year old son named Jude, and we have a dog named Noble, who is, we got him thinking he would be like a therapy dog.

    [00:07:15] Neal Samudre: But he's a dog that needs therapy. He's really anxious, barks all the time. You might hear him in the background of this, but we love him. And our little boy is just our whole world, our whole delight. But, you know, things I like to do for fun. I love to write. I love to run. I love to watch football. And Be a nerd about football.

    [00:07:43] Neal Samudre: I love to cook every weekend. I cook like signature dishes for people. And it is Friday at the time of this recording. I'm like plotting out my brain, what big dish I'm going to make for people. Uh, but yeah, that's the stuff I like to do for fun. That's me.

    [00:08:01] Whitney Owens: I love that. So now I know where to go when I'm in your area and when I want dinner.

    [00:08:06] Neal Samudre: Oh yes. And you know, I'm a hundred percent Indian. I love cooking Indian food for people. So when you're in the Nashville area, come on over and I'll make you an Indian feast.

    [00:08:16] Whitney Owens: Nice. Nice. Okay. And I have to ask for football. Cause I like football as well. Are you college or NFL

    [00:08:23] Neal Samudre: NFL?

    [00:08:24] Whitney Owens: And I'm going to guess your team is the Titans.

    [00:08:27] Neal Samudre: Yes it is.

    [00:08:28] Whitney Owens: Okay. Great. I've run by the stadium for a couple of times when I've been in Nashville. So I like to run as well.

    [00:08:35] Neal Samudre: Tighten up baby.

    [00:08:37] Whitney Owens: That's right. Well, I am a Falcons fan, so you can feel sad for me.

    [00:08:42] Neal Samudre: Well, I don't know. You got third cousins there and Michael Pennings Jr. So you might have a good year.

    [00:08:47] Whitney Owens: Might have a good year. Well, somebody's got a root for them. So I do. All right. So, um, but great. So let's talk about this idea of risk taking in private practice. Kenny, why don't you first share, what are you seeing as a trend right now for practice owners that you're doing consulting with?

    [00:09:06] Neal Samudre: So this topic is so timely.

    [00:09:09] Neal Samudre: Because the mental health industry is rapidly changing. There is the counseling compact coming out. There's emergence of telehealth that I feel like private practices are still trying to get used to how to be a virtual practice. There's these mental health tech companies like headway Alma that are just sweeping the market.

    [00:09:35] Neal Samudre: And with all this change. There's a lot of pressure on private practice therapists, group practice owners to adapt, to keep up with the change. But what I'm noticing is a lot of private practice therapists know what they should do to adapt to the change. But they don't make the leap there is fear and anxiety and a little bit of imposter syndrome tied to those decisions and so before coming on this podcast, you know, I was Praying about it and I feel really led to talk about this How do we grow our practice from a place of peace and joy?

    [00:10:21] Neal Samudre: rather than fear and Anxiety and this imposter syndrome. How do we navigate that so that we can make the leaps necessary to grow our business, to expand our care to the communities that need it.

    [00:10:38] Whitney Owens: Yeah, I need to know how to do that.

    [00:10:43] Whitney Owens: Yeah, because we definitely are living in fear. That's for sure. And even your topic that you're bringing up, I mean, I think any therapist would benefit from that. But I think specifically, we're talking to faith based, you know, private practice owners and living from a place of faith. You know, it's kind of somewhat the opposite, I guess, the brisk.

    [00:10:59] Whitney Owens: I mean, I guess you could say it differently, but that's what I was thinking.

    [00:11:02] Neal Samudre: Absolutely. Absolutely. So many private practice owners, they have fear attached to these decisions. Now I believe that the emotion of fear, it's a good thing. You know, it's the Bible tells us. that wisdom comes from fear. The emotion of fear is a good thing, but the spirit of fear is a bad thing.

    [00:11:27] Neal Samudre: Why? The biblical sense tells us that, or the biblical reason tells us that God did not give us the spirit of fear. I believe that there are practice owners that have this spirit of fear where they're making their decisions out of, you know, The spirit of fear, they're treading lightly. They, uh, are expecting the worst and somewhat making the worst happen by their expectation of it.

    [00:11:55] Neal Samudre: That's what a spirit of fear is. It's a posture. It's different than that emotion of fear that leads us to make wise decisions. It's a whole spirit of fear.

    [00:12:09] Whitney Owens: I like how you're presenting that. I actually have been thinking about this idea. I'm going to go a little different direction here, but maybe it'll make sense to you how there's like, principalities and powers in the world.

    [00:12:20] Neal Samudre: Yes,

    [00:12:21] Whitney Owens: there's like, the power of breed. Narcissism, sexuality, immorality, these kinds of things. And so, even as you say that, I'm thinking, gosh, that almost just sounds like this big power kind of over our culture. Right. You know, and it's keeping Christians from living in the best life that God has and really doing his work in the world.

    [00:12:43] Whitney Owens: Like, when we live in that spirit of fear, we're not stepping forward. And then all this other stuff might happen. Like, I even think like, a simple idea of maybe just starting a practice. You don't start a practice because of a spirit of fear. Well, here's all these people that would have been impacted for the kingdom.

    [00:12:59] Whitney Owens: You're missing.

    [00:13:00] Neal Samudre: Absolutely. Absolutely. So, you know, Whitney, there's this concept that I talk about a lot whenever I speak to audiences, whenever I write, whenever I'm coaching my clients, but it's this idea of feeling safe. You know, I'm the joy guy, right? And as the joy guy, play is essential to joy. And I feel like there are so many practice owners and entrepreneurs who need to tap into the spirit of play.

    [00:13:33] Neal Samudre: Where we're having fun with our practices, where we enjoy what we're doing. Because when you do things out of play and joy, You tap into this inner genius, this creativity that comes from God. And so we grow our business when we feel safe to play, but too many practice owners are playing it safe. And that's not just a word play.

    [00:13:59] Neal Samudre: We play it safe when we view the world as a threat when we make these fear based decisions, when we are anxious about the growth of our practice and whether it's sustainable. So we make decisions that are just playing it safe when I feel like God is calling us to feel safe to play. That makes sense.

    [00:14:27] Whitney Owens: Oh, it makes total sense.

    [00:14:28] Whitney Owens: I, I actually, you might have seen this on social media because you know how I am about social media. Um, I was just in California last week with 3 other practice centers. They're like, in my mastermind group. So, as you're saying, I want to come

    [00:14:40] Neal Samudre: next time.

    [00:14:41] Whitney Owens: Okay. Yes, let's do it. A lot of fun. Yeah. And you'll see all those people at the summit just saying, um, but anyway, so, When we were together, we played and I, and I remember sitting there thinking this feels so safe.

    [00:15:00] Whitney Owens: Yes. Right. These people are safe for me and I can be totally myself be silly and play and not have to worry about rejection or fear. And it's in those places that all of us, I think they would say this where we all felt inspired. Like we all make good decisions about our practice. I came back feeling so much more confident about my calling.

    [00:15:24] Whitney Owens: Yeah,

    [00:15:25] Neal Samudre: that's why I love what you're doing with the wise practice community. You're getting people together and building the supportive community where you're saying, Hey, you're not alone in this stuff. That's one of the best ways. To get out of our fear and anxiety is to get into a supportive community that gets it, but also calls you out of yourself.

    [00:15:48] Whitney Owens: Ooh, calls you out of yourself. Yeah.

    [00:15:51] Neal Samudre: Yeah. Because you know, when you're growing a business, the biggest obstacle you face to grow in a business is getting in your own way. You are the greatest bottleneck. And so, so many practice owners, they have patterns from the past, or they might be carrying the fear and anxiety of their clients into their business.

    [00:16:13] Neal Samudre: And because of that, they get in their own way, again, the way of their own growth. You know what I mean? And so being in a supportive community, like the one you're building, it calls us out of ourselves.

    [00:16:27] Whitney Owens: Well, I, I appreciate that. I love it. But yeah, let's talk some more about those, uh, hurdles, challenges that are getting in the way of taking risks.

    [00:17:32] Neal Samudre: Yeah. Well, you know, I mentioned this a little bit, but I feel like therapists, private practice owners. They're in a special position when it comes to navigating fear, risk, and anxiety with growing their business, because they spend their entire days talking with clients that have intense trauma, and they're having to hold so much emotional space.

    [00:18:01] Neal Samudre: For these clients. And they're also having to hold so much time to sit with these clients that at the end of the day, there's so many practice owners that feel like there's just nothing left to grow their business, to be excited about the future, right? And that's where we really have to start when we're growing our business.

    [00:18:22] Neal Samudre: We have to be excited about the future we're building, but it's really hard to have that excitement and enthusiasm when we sit with hard stories. Every day. Do you feel that?

    [00:18:34] Whitney Owens: Well, I'm thinking about it because I don't see a lot of clients anymore. I see like three a week, maybe because it made it hard for me to work on my business.

    [00:18:45] Whitney Owens: Absolutely, but I'm, I'm thinking about what it was like when I saw so many clients. Yeah, it makes it really hard for me to find myself because I'm so in what they're going through. Right? And it's exhausting emotionally, like, I'm tapped out. So I could see myself, you know, when I'm tired emotionally, it's a lot harder to harness truth.

    [00:19:08] Whitney Owens: You know, getting in the word, believing that, because I just want to go back to my old patterns, because I'm tired. Yes. I'm not good enough, I can't do this, I don't have enough money, you know, so I just go back to those, because I'm too tired to move forward.

    [00:19:22] Neal Samudre: And there's another thing, too, where We deal with so many hard stories that we almost become numb a little bit, but then we take that numbness into our business and we normalize chaos and fires inside of our practice.

    [00:19:39] Neal Samudre: Like we create this narrative that it I'm chasing all these fires. I'm constantly putting out fires. I'm like the ring master in my business, but it's totally okay. Because I feel good with this, but really what's happening is I feel like a lot of practice owners are just numb to chaos because of this exposure factor that we're exposed to so many hard stories.

    [00:20:10] Neal Samudre: Um, and again, going back to community, this is where I feel like having the support of community really helps because then you start exposing yourself to different narratives, a different perspective, people who can call you out of yourself because exposure really does play a factor into our mindset and what we imagine is possible for our practice.

    [00:20:34] Neal Samudre: Hmm.

    [00:20:37] Whitney Owens: So I'm thinking maybe people run away from relationship and community. Because they don't wanna deal with themselves maybe.

    [00:20:47] Neal Samudre: Yeah. You know, I feel like there are practice owners out there who can run away from relationships and being vulnerable because, you know, we do enter into those narratives of like, I shouldn't be going through this.

    [00:21:00] Neal Samudre: Mm-Hmm. I should, I'm the only one that struggles with this. Mm-Hmm. I should have my stuff together. Mm-Hmm. . And that shame causes us to dodge vulnerability and being open in these communities.

    [00:21:15] Whitney Owens: Especially when you're seeing a lot of clients, you're kind of in the muck with all your clients. You just feel like you can't do anything else.

    [00:21:23] Neal Samudre: Absolutely. There also is this pervasive imposter syndrome that is just running rampant with practice owners. We feel like we are not qualified enough to be growing these uber successful practices. Um, and so we do sabotage ourselves a little bit. back down to the level that we know we can tolerate. Uh, but it's just because of this imposter syndrome.

    [00:21:53] Neal Samudre: And yeah, I've talked to so many practice owners who struggle with that. They can't see themselves as a seven figure practice owner because they still have the mindset of like a six figure. Uh, practice owner that does stuff solo. Do you see that?

    [00:22:12] Whitney Owens: Yeah, definitely. I see it, especially people who think they can't really be a boss.

    [00:22:19] Whitney Owens: You know, I can't lead people. I don't have this capability. I don't know what I'm doing. Or, um, maybe when they're setting their rates as a therapist. Why would someone pay that to come see me? You know, I don't have anything to offer. And I'm like, yes, you do.

    [00:22:34] Neal Samudre: There's so many decisions that they know that they should do to make that leap forward in their practice, but they don't because there's this ceiling, this imposter syndrome.

    [00:22:43] Neal Samudre: And I feel like the thing that I want to tell a lot of practice owners is that if you want the authority to undo that imposter syndrome, the only way to gain that authority. It's to get started and go through something because it is through experience that we gain authority. So we really just have to get going.

    [00:23:10] Whitney Owens: Yeah, I actually heard Brene Brown recently on a podcast. And she said, if you only knew how many times I failed, like, no, 1 knows that I can't tell you how many books and how many pages were all over the floor, you know, of rejection rejection letters and things that didn't work out. And you're right. It's only through our pain and suffering that we really can have success.

    [00:23:33] Whitney Owens: You know, really can move forward and what God's calling us to.

    [00:23:36] Neal Samudre: Absolutely. And speaking about failure, I feel like that's another factor to why practice owners fear risk and making those big leaps that they know they should be making in their practices because they've had failures somewhere in their story, whether it was in their professional careers, but even in their upbringing, in their family life.

    [00:24:01] Neal Samudre: You know, we're all therapists listening to this podcast. You know what I'm talking about, but they're carrying the story of failure that shoots themselves in the foot before they even get started. They're too hard on themselves.

    [00:24:17] Whitney Owens: It's interesting how it's so real, like that pain for people is so real, but at the same time, it doesn't really determine you at all.

    [00:24:26] Neal Samudre: Absolutely. And you know, what's interesting about this whole discussion is that, uh, because they have this story of failure in their past, they fear they're so hypersensitive. It's a failure that they don't take that first step. But whenever you make a big leap in your practice growth, that first step you make is always going to be hyper uncomfortable.

    [00:24:54] Neal Samudre: It's always going to be very painful. But then when you make that first step, the second step is better. The third step is better. The fourth step is better. There's this whole, uh, concept in, I think it was Ray Dalio's Principles book, but he was talking about first, second, third order consequences. And usually when you make a decision that's good for your future, the first order consequence is that it's painful.

    [00:25:26] Neal Samudre: It hurts. But then the second order consequence is good. The third order consequence is better. The fourth order consequence is amazing. And so an example is, you know, if. You want to eat healthy, let's say. Um, eating that bite of carrot is probably not gonna taste as great to you at first. This is such a, like, weird example.

    [00:25:50] Neal Samudre: But the second consequence is like, you feel proud of yourself that you ate the carrot. And then you probably have more energy in the day, and then you can probably play with your kids, you know, that's an example of how this plays out. But because a lot of practice owners have this story of failure and fear, uh, they fear that first step, which is usually painful at first, but reaps such positive fruit in their lives.

    [00:26:22] Neal Samudre: You know what I'm talking about.

    [00:26:24] Whitney Owens: Mm hmm. Yeah, of course, we were talking about running earlier, but I'm thinking about running. It's like when you haven't run in a while or you've never run, you get out there to run. Oh, it's terrible. Terrible hard, but every step gets a little easier. And then you have those consequences that you're talking about.

    [00:26:41] Whitney Owens: Oh, I did it. You know, good about yourself or you have more energy later in the day, or you lose weight and all that kind of stuff. And then you become like, addicted to running.

    [00:26:50] Neal Samudre: Absolutely. And bringing it down to practice owners. You know, starting a group practice, hiring your first therapist. It's tough, it's hard, right?

    [00:27:00] Neal Samudre: Mm-Hmm, , you're gonna feel uncomfortable with it. But then the second order consequence is that you're gonna be proud of yourself as a practice owner. You're gonna build some systems that make people really want to be at your group practice. Third order consequence is, you know, you're gonna make more money.

    [00:27:17] Neal Samudre: You just. Will you can probably see less clients because you want to work more on the business. You get to impact your clinicians lives. And then fourth order consequence, you get to make a true impact in your community. And then if you want to go even further, you get to make an impact to future generations that follow after you, you know, I am a first generation Indian.

    [00:27:45] Neal Samudre: Like my parents moved here. I was born here, but because I have this background of. This being in an immigrant family, I'm always thinking about the legacy that I want my kids to have after me, the generations that follow me, because I am really setting a precedence for those generations. And it's the same with practice owners.

    [00:28:10] Neal Samudre: You know, if you can build a systematized, highly profitable group practice that you are proud of, you know what you're showing the generations after you. You're showing them that they can, they can do big things and they're going to take that possibility. And they're going to turn it into something wonderful and then they're going to show their kids and then they're going to show their kids.

    [00:28:35] Neal Samudre: And it just spans generation, but it always starts with that first order consequence, that painful first step that you know, you got to make. Yeah.

    [00:28:48] Whitney Owens: So, so some of this is knowing what could come by taking the first step. It sounds like thinking about what's down the line. I mean, even as you're sharing generational, I'm thinking about.

    [00:29:01] Whitney Owens: All the clients that we get to impact those clients are doing better in their families because they came here for therapy, right? So they can, they can have better communication with their spouse. They can care better for their children. Everyone's healthier, happier. And if you're a Christian practice, they're growing within their faith too.

    [00:29:19] Whitney Owens: And then they're passing all that down. So it is that ripple effect that you're talking about.

    [00:29:24] Neal Samudre: Isn't doesn't that just pump you up? Doesn't that fill you with joy? Like, this is how. We're partnering in kingdom work, right? And if we are the only bottleneck to that, if we are the only obstacle, if we can just stop getting in our own way.

    [00:29:46] Neal Samudre: Imagine how much good can come from that.

    [00:29:51] Whitney Owens: And you saw my facial expression. It's like, Ooh, yuck. Thinking about myself getting in the way of kingdom work. That feels pretty bad,

    [00:29:59] Neal Samudre: but you know, God is a God of healing and he says. Cast your fear and anxiety on me because I care. And so we might have this spirit of fear.

    [00:30:13] Neal Samudre: We might have that anxiety in this imposter syndrome, but we really can cast it to God because he does care. You know, At the beginning of this podcast, we were talking about, um, my business, entrecare, and really with entrecare, I have this vision that I want to empower the helpers, because if you want to build a more joyful and healed world.

    [00:30:39] Neal Samudre: You got to start with the helpers, but a lot of that work starts by empowering them. Yes, with business systems and tools to scale their practice, but also caring for who they are as people, providing them the care to be courageous through their own story. If we can adopt that sense of care, not, uh, just from, um, our community, but from God, I feel like we can take big, bold, courageous steps.

    [00:31:20] Whitney Owens: Hmm. I love that. Yeah. So as you're, as you're talking, I'm thinking, okay, what, what do we want to give to therapists, you know, here today to allow them to take risks? So I kind of just heard you saying, thinking about the next generation, thinking about the impact, thinking about God's compassion for us.

    [00:31:41] Neal Samudre: Absolutely. And another thing too, community. We kept circling around that topic, but community is big to making this leap. A community coaching. You know, uh, having a coach like you who can see those hearts, that potential and just call it out, that is so key to doing this work, to making these big leaps in our practice, but also, um, I want to leave therapists with just.

    [00:32:20] Neal Samudre: The call to action to just take some time to reflect in journal and really consider the ways that you might be getting in the way of yourself and your own potential and be honest about it. Uh, just don't be too critical about it to the point where you're paralyzed by it. That paralysis will. Shut us down before you even get started.

    [00:32:48] Neal Samudre: But we do have to have this place of honesty where we're honest with ourselves, shine the mirror back on ourselves and ask, um, what is it that I'm doing, like in my patterns, in my decision making? Um, in my spirit, that's throttling my potential.

    [00:33:12] Whitney Owens: Hmm. Yeah. And that's difficult. So many things. Yeah. It's very difficult for sure.

    [00:33:19] Whitney Owens: And that goes back to community too. Having people that you're sharing your maybe thoughts, ideas, fears so that they can call you out too. Because a lot of times we don't see that within ourselves.

    [00:33:31] Neal Samudre: And you know what? Not many of us have friends that call us out, and I believe that's super crucial, call us out in a gentle way, right?

    [00:33:42] Neal Samudre: Not in a way that we can't receive it, but to have a community of people that tell us us. Our truths about ourselves tell us when we might be self sabotaging a lot of us as practice owners don't have that because we're so busy inside of our practice and putting out the fires and doing all the things that.

    [00:34:07] Neal Samudre: We're not cultivating intimacy within our own communities where people see the real us.

    [00:34:16] Whitney Owens: Yeah, I find that concept to be even harder as my practice grows, right? There's more on the line or how, how much do I share my risks and my thoughts with my team? You know, and finding other people that get it and can call me out and not like, this sounds a little arrogant, but like, you know, they might be like, oh, Whitney's got this big practice.

    [00:34:40] Whitney Owens: I can't say anything to her. You know what I mean? Where it's like, no, I actually really need this, you know?

    [00:34:46] Neal Samudre: Absolutely. Like, really. The only difference between people like you and me that have successful group practices and people who are trying to go their group practice is that, uh, we felt those emotions.

    [00:35:00] Neal Samudre: We felt that fear, anxiety, and imposter syndrome. But the only difference is that we just kept going because we knew how to care for ourselves in those dips, you know,

    [00:35:18] Whitney Owens: Yeah. And it's still, I feel all that stuff

    [00:35:21] Neal Samudre: sometimes. Absolutely. We never escape it. Right. It, we face it at every level. It just looks different at every level.

    [00:35:31] Whitney Owens: This has been so good. Is there anything we haven't touched on yet that you wanted to make sure to mention

    [00:35:36] Neal Samudre: with risk and stuff? I think we've touched on it. If there's one thing I want people to take away from this podcast, it's that don't be afraid, don't be anxious. Don't fear risk. The greatest risk is not taking any risks at all, right?

    [00:35:58] Neal Samudre: That's the greatest risk. We don't have to fear the pressures off pressures off. We can cast our fear and anxieties on God and we can move from playing it safe to feeling safe to play and just think about the communities and generations that will be impacted if we just feel safe to play.

    [00:36:22] Whitney Owens: Well, Neil, this might be one of those episodes I go back and listen to every few weeks.

    [00:36:27] Neal Samudre: Yeah. If you ever need a mindset ramp up, I'm your guy, come to me. I will rally you. .

    [00:36:34] Whitney Owens: Yes. All right. Okay, so if you could share a little bit about, you're coming to the Wise Practice Summit in Charlotte this year, so share with them a little bit about what you're gonna be talking about with the practice owners.

    [00:36:46] Neal Samudre: I'm going to be talking about this very subject, but we're going to go deep. Like everyone who's going to hear our talk that I'm doing with my wife, you're going to walk away inspired. It's going to be a mindset work, right? Where you are going to be Enthusiastic about your future. And you're going to really cover that, uh, first step of growing your practice, which really the first step is mindset work, believing in the possibility, believing in your own potential.

    [00:37:27] Neal Samudre: So everyone who's going to come and listen to that talk. They're going to be so excited about the future that they're building with their practice. And it's not just like some rally talk, like woohoo mindset, like believe in yourself. We're going to be going through some tools, some practical tools that I take my clients with whenever I see them getting in their own way, like we're going to go through tools and they're going to end that session with joy.

    [00:38:00] Neal Samudre: So I hope everyone's ready for it.

    [00:38:03] Whitney Owens: Oh, yeah. Well, I am and I'm not, right? That would be great. Um, all right. And so, you know, we haven't really talked about this too much yet, but I always love when guests come on and have freebies. And one of the things you kind of told us about was your platform and dashboard for practice owners.

    [00:38:21] Neal Samudre: Yes. So if you go to entrecare. com, um, you'll see awesome language and copy around scaling your practice without compromise. And one of the ways we fill fulfill that promise is with this dashboard and system we built called the empowered practice system. And really it's a project or practice management system where you can use it to set goals.

    [00:38:50] Neal Samudre: Uh, define your KPIs, run supervisions and meetings through it, uh, keep track of clinician data, but also record and document all your SOPs and your systems. But we have this whole process where We adapt this system and customize it for your practice so that it systematizes and streamlines a practice so that you do have more time and margin to be able to invest in the things that matter to you and your priorities, you see, that's what entre care is all about.

    [00:39:26] Neal Samudre: Like you don't have to compromise. Uh, your wellbeing to grow your business because that's the, and I'll just say one quick little thing to that. That's the fork in the road that a lot of practice owners face is they want to grow their practice, but they feel like to grow their practice past the ceiling that they keep bumping their head against, they either have to burn out or they have to shrink their practice down.

    [00:39:55] Neal Samudre: To a more sustainable level of care. And they just keep shrinking their practice down. And I always get sad whenever I see group practice owners close down their doors, because they just engage in this pattern where they kept shrinking, shrinking down until there's nothing left. And so the whole idea of Dia of scaling their practice without compromise is that you don't have to compromise anything to grow your practice with the empowered practice system.

    [00:40:22] Neal Samudre: We will empower your practice. With a systematized streamlined process so that no compromise has to happen. You can take care of yourself, your wellbeing, your priorities, and to grow your business. So anyways, uh, if you want to see a demo of that, just head to entrecare. com and, uh, I'll show you that demo.

    [00:40:49] Whitney Owens: Great. Great. And now somebody is listening and they're thinking, man, it's Neil. He knows his stuff. I want some coaching. How can they get in touch with you? Go

    [00:40:58] Neal Samudre: to Onscare. com. And when you book that demo call. Like I'll see if it's a good fit. If we can do some coaching, consulting work together, we can install that system into your practice and we can talk about the deep stuff if you want.

    [00:41:15] Whitney Owens: And

    [00:41:16] Neal Samudre: we'll do it.

    [00:41:17] Whitney Owens: Right. Perfect. And if you are interested in meeting Neil in person, you can come to the summit. I'm looking forward to all the deep conversations are going to have when you have two and a half days to be with people.

    [00:41:29] Neal Samudre: Oh, yes. Get ready to reach another level. Of yourself, of your practice after that talk, we are going to inspire you to just want to grow your practice to another level.

    [00:41:43] Neal Samudre: I'm so excited.

    [00:41:45] Whitney Owens: Oh, well, I am too. Well, I'm looking forward to it because then I'll finally get to see you in person. And I've loved this interview. I love your enthusiasm and passion and also authenticity about life is hard and the risks are hard and we're going to move forward together.

    [00:41:59] Neal Samudre: Absolutely.

    [00:42:01] Whitney Owens: Well, thank you again for coming on the show.

    [00:42:24] Whitney Owens: Special thanks to Marty Altman for the music in this podcast. The Wise Practice Podcast is part of the Sitecraft Podcast Network, a collaboration of independent podcasters focused on helping people live more meaningful and productive lives. To learn more about the other amazing podcasts in the network, head on over to sitecraftnetwork.

    [00:42:44] Whitney Owens: com. The Wise Practice Podcast represents the opinions of Whitney Owens and her guests. This podcast is for educational purposes only, and the content should not be taken as legal advice. If you have legal questions, please consult an attorney.



James Marland
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